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Author Topic: WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition  (Read 11890 times)

Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #30 on: June 15, 2005, 10:58:26 am »

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First, a controlled demolition of a large structure is not a clandestine business.  You've got to have access to every inch of the building.  There are demo packs against every load-bearing structure, det cord and cables are strung everywhere, sometimes you've got to saw partway through structural members.  It would take weeks of loud and obvious work for trained teams to prep a building the size of a WTC tower for a demo like that, and the traces would be everywhere.  Somebody would comment.

Second, the article(s) I read seemed to argue that the airplanes were a hoax.  There was more of the "hole's too small" argument.  But the planes hit the buildings in a very, very public manner; especially the second one.  It wasn't a mass hallucination.  The planes were there.

 
Okay. First, as noted already, George Walker Bush's youngest brother was on the board of the company which ran the "security" for Larry Silverstein's properties at the WTC. That security company had every access to the buildings for a long time before 911.

Secondly, I've proven that the NIST and FEMA have both lied outright about how WTC 7 came down, and the building's owner himself says publicly, as broadcast on PBS, that he and FDNY decided to "pull it" (WTC 7). Since the decision to "pull it" came after FDNY had called Silverstein with the bad news that FDNY could not put out the fires in WTC 7, that means that the entire preparation for the demolition of WTC 7 would have had to be executed in less than five hours. *That* of course is impossible to do, as you've so correctly noted. *That* means that the explosives were already in the buildihg before the morning of 911. And *that* means that 911 was an inside job.

Thirdly, I agree with you that the airplanes were not a hoax, that there were two airliners (of debatable types) which dove into the twin towers. What that does not prove, however, is that the airliners which hit the buildings were flghts 11 and 175 - they could have been U.S. Air Force tankers full of fuel. We all know that the 757 and the 767 both come stock from Boeing with ground-control systems which allow for FAA and/or NORAD to take over control of the flight of the plane from the ground.

We also now know that on the 23rd floor of WTC 7 was a Secret Service, CIA, Port Authority, FEMA, and U.S. military command, control, and communications bunker using state-of-the-art PROMISS software which was capable of over-riding Pentagon, FEMA, NSA, CIA, FAA, and NORAD  communications and radar systems. And we know that all of that was under the command of Dick Cheney, who just chanced on that morning to be running five wargame drills which included "live-fly" exercises and fake "insertions" of false hijack "blips" on the FAA's and NORAD's  radar screens - which showed up at FAA and NORAD as 22 hijackings in progress at the same time.

Knowing that much, we must ask ourselves this - How the hell did Osama bin Laden know that Dick Cheney's wargame drills would effectively shut down the entire east coast's air defense system for several hours on the morning of 911, and know that information well in advance, so he could order his nineteen "hijackers" to the proper airports for boarding the proper flights?

WTC 7 is the slip-up which shall bring down this criminal syndicate's entire house of cards.

Think on these things...

:)

Elias
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #31 on: June 15, 2005, 11:11:01 am »

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Just looking into the heat issue is still missing the fact that the buildings structural members were FIRST hit by an airplane that weighed 315,000 lbs, not including fuel, passengers, cargo, etc.  I don't know of much that could withstand that without some damage.  Add a fire on top of that and the thing fell like a house of cards.

As I said before, the government is too stupid to be able to pull something like a controlled demo off.  Don't give them credit they don't deserve.
We have seismic evidence showing that the towers both "stabilized" after the impacts. They stood for quite some time before collapsing. Again, I admonish you to get some of the videos which are readily available. One I've already linked for you. Another great one is the Directors Cut of "911 In Plane Site" by Dave von Kleist. In the director's cut version of this film, he goes to great lengths to show how the government's lies simply won't hold water in the light of scrutiny. The visiuals are amazing. Go get this film before you stick your foot deeper into your mouth, lol!

http://www.911inplanesite.com/911review_di...fotainment.html

:)
Elias
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #32 on: June 15, 2005, 11:15:10 am »

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It would seem to me that structural failure due to heat is the cause.  The steel did not melt, it was just heated.  Blacksmiths don't melt iron or steel to bend and shape it, they just heat it. 

 
I agree.  In the fire service, we have a term for elevator shafts and stairways. They are called chimneys.  It sucks to have to drag a hose up a smoke filled, very hot stairway.

ultralongrunner
The core shafts of WTC 1 and WTC 2 were both constructed so as to "hermetically seal" off entire sections of the buildings in case of fire. The engineers who designed the buildings wanted to prevent the "chimney effect".

:)
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #33 on: June 15, 2005, 11:18:14 am »

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WTC 7 videos:

Link 1

Link 2

My question is: were the WTC structures interconnected below street level? That would be the only way #7 and first tower that was hit could have collasped. The tower that was hit first would not have collasped on its own, it was hit to high. IIRC, it collasped from the bottom. Right? My point being the first tower that went down copromised the foundation to such an extent the rest of the WTC structures collasped.
I've seen the satellite imagery on the heat-fields below the rubble days and even weeks later. There is considerable reason to suspect that a mini-nuke was in the basement of each of the twin towers. That could explain the molten steel days after the collapses.

:)
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2005, 11:27:50 am »

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HEAT; it is the weakest point in the whole story of the collapse of WTC 1 and 2.


Elias, I have wondered what the insurance trial transripts would tell us?  I am referring to the trial wherein Silverstein was paid for the "accident".  Those transcripts should contain some information, possibly very valuable info about the causes of the collapse.  Or do you think that they avoided the issue?  Regardless, I would like to check into that.  Do you know where in New York the trial was held?  I might be able to travel to that courthouse and request a copy of that trial.

Every time I hear Silverstein, or I read about his admission, I can actually feel my mental resistance to the whole idea kick in....kinda like that is such a huge, shocking OH MY GOD!!!   if that guy said that, then that means......NO, it can't be I won't believe it I can't believe THAT!

so very wierd that feeling is...
I agree with you, that questions about "heat" are a very damning problem for the criminals inside the government who committed the mass murders of 911. The towers stood with streams of black smoke for some time before their collapses. Black smoke indicates lower burning temps.  

About Silverstein's settlement with the insurance company - I'm not sure if there was even a trial, but if there was a trial, you can bet your last dollar that the Fedgov has already put a gag order on the transcript. But Silverstein may have settled out of court. According to Alex Jones, Silverstein netted a cool five hundred million bucks for his pains on that day. That is "Net", not gross. :)

I must have watched Silverstein's live statement forty or more times. It's on quite a few films which I watch here. One thing which brings a smile to my face is the fact that he waited so long to announce that. By the time he came out with it, FEMA had already made complete fools and liars of themselves with their "official" report.

Oh, well.... at least, we all know that Roosevelt did not break the Japanese code before Pearl Harbor, right?

:)

Salute!
Elias
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Thunder

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2005, 11:28:00 am »

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There is considerable reason to suspect that a mini-nuke was in the basement of each of the twin towers.
Oh, dear God!

I like you and all that, Elias, but you just lost all credibility with that statement.

And you had the gall to warn ME about sticking my foot in my mouth?

Here's some info that might help you out:  Not everything that happens is a government conspiracy and a cover-up.  I took a dump this morning before I came into work.  Do you think the gov was behind that, too?  Maybe they genetically altered my DNA to make it so I had to defecate shortly after I woke in the morning.

I say that in jest, but I hope you understand how senseless and paranoid my above example is.  It's the exact same impression that you are giving with your explanation of 9/11.

Take some meds.  Or stop taking whatever it is you are taking.  Whatever you're doing or not doing, it isn't helping you to maintain a grasp on reality.

 
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Bill St. Clair

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #36 on: June 15, 2005, 11:28:18 am »

Quote
I've seen the satellite imagery on the heat-fields below the rubble days and even weeks later. There is considerable reason to suspect that a mini-nuke was in the basement of each of the twin towers. That could explain the molten steel days after the collapses.

:)
I mini-nuke, eh? That's the first I've heard of that theory. Or does your smiley mean that you're joking?

I've read a lot of theories about the disaster on 9/11/2001. Many of them sound plausible, including the official story. I have even mirrored a couple of 9/11 web sites on my own, just to make sure they survive. Bottom line: I don't know whether it was a planned controlled demolition carried out by our government, or a collapse caused by bad engineering and two jet planes. Most of the players in the official story are dead, so we'll never hear a confession from them. If it was carried out by the government, we'll likely hear confessions a few years down the pike, or maybe not.

I do know one thing, however. The 9/11 "attack" has been used by the U.S. government as an excuse to massively curtail our civil liberties. If they didn't plan it, they might as well have. The result has been the same as if they had.
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Mostly Harmless

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #37 on: June 15, 2005, 11:34:22 am »

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911 was an inside job.

Dick Cheney is a former Director at the Council on Foreign Relations.

Ali Mohammed was on the FBI's payroll when he wrote the manual for Jihad for al Qeada.

The Federal Reserve System, Inc., is the biggest counterfeit operation on earth.
 
IIRC, that "bearded guerrilla fighter with a kidney problem living in a cave in Afghanistan" was a CIA (and I don't mean the Culinary Institute of America) asset for many years.

If you've lived all your life within the borders of ConUSA, you probably have a very limited knowledge of just how much the various dirty tricks departments of Fed.gov interfere in the affairs of sovereign nations. Even their allies are not off-limits -- they've messed around with the Brits for years.

In countries where the police state, uh "development", is lagging behind the USA and Western Europe they don't even bother to cover their tracks very much.

Apart from sheer raw power, I can't for the life of me fathom why they do what they do.  And I must be seriously lacking in testosterone or something, because I just don't get off on the whole "unlimited power" kick.... :(  :rolleyes:  
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #38 on: June 15, 2005, 11:36:48 am »

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Take some meds.  Or stop taking whatever it is you are taking.  Whatever you're doing or not doing, it isn't helping you to maintain a grasp on reality.
Well, we shall see what we shall see. I think I'm gonna stick to my guns on this. I did not state as fact that a mini-nuke was in the basement of each building, I stated that there is reason to look into that as a possibility. I am convinced that a criminal element within our government did 911. Our government does possess mini-nukes. You apparently don't choose to think that. No point in arguing with you about it, I'm sure, so like I just said, we shall see what we shall see.

But btw, did you read that Northwoods Document yet?

One thing I like about message boards is that the posts are dated when they are made. It's like they become a record of who said what when, y'kno?

:)

Salute!
Elias
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Harleqwin

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #39 on: June 15, 2005, 11:39:32 am »

The second tower hit, first to fall was hit by the airplane at an angle, not dead on perpendicular.  That means that most of the kinetic energy would project along that same path; a path that would avoid the central core of the building.  This is a plausible explanation that leaves very little structural damage to what is holding up the building.  (also, an undetermined amount of the fuel burned at that time - outside the envelope of the building.)

That is the first tower to fall.  No major fire, no major structural damage to the central core.

Which law of Physics is it that would apply to an object in motion?  Inertia?

Thunder, I do not wish to argue nor do I want to be unfriendly.  I shall again ask you to read the FEMA report, both the beginning (Preface?) and the chapter that deals with WTC 1 and 2.  There are also several good diagrams of the floor layout that will visually show much better than I can explain.

Jet fuel is gone in 15 minutes; normal office fire; no other explanation, no other fuel souce.
That train of fact points to no evidence of steel weakening temperatures.  That is what is left unsaid, unproven in the FEMA report.
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Joel

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #40 on: June 15, 2005, 11:41:21 am »

On whatever details we may differ, I think we can all agree that:
Quote
The 9/11 "attack" has been used by the U.S. government as an excuse to massively curtail our civil liberties. If they didn't plan it, they might as well have. The result has been the same as if they had.
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Elias Alias

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #41 on: June 15, 2005, 11:42:41 am »

Quote
Quote
911 was an inside job.

Dick Cheney is a former Director at the Council on Foreign Relations.

Ali Mohammed was on the FBI's payroll when he wrote the manual for Jihad for al Qeada.

The Federal Reserve System, Inc., is the biggest counterfeit operation on earth.
 
IIRC, that "bearded guerrilla fighter with a kidney problem living in a cave in Afghanistan" was a CIA (and I don't mean the Culinary Institute of America) asset for many years.

If you've lived all your life within the borders of ConUSA, you probably have a very limited knowledge of just how much the various dirty tricks departments of Fed.gov interfere in the affairs of sovereign nations. Even their allies are not off-limits -- they've messed around with the Brits for years.

In countries where the police state, uh "development", is lagging behind the USA and Western Europe they don't even bother to cover their tracks very much.

Apart from sheer raw power, I can't for the life of me fathom why they do what they do.  And I must be seriously lacking in testosterone or something, because I just don't get off on the whole "unlimited power" kick.... :(  :rolleyes:
Exactly.

And as we know, any CIA asset shall be given only the knowledge deemed necessary by his superior commanders, which, regarding the operation on 911,  I believe was Dick Cheney. I seriously doubt that Cheney felt Osama had a "need to know", so I don't think bin Laden even knew what was going down with the Secret Service and CIA and the Pentagon and etc that morning, you know, all the things relating to the five wargame drills.

I agree with you. I think that the CIA's tasks nowadays include the very important task of creating "enemies" so that the public will continue to feed the Defense contracting community through a tax base. I'm pretty sure that if we were not creating enemies, the Fed's fake economy would fall in upon itself with even more fanfare than we see in the collapse of the twin towers.

Salute!
Elias
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Thunder

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #42 on: June 15, 2005, 12:02:45 pm »

I don't want to get into a big argument, either.  Nor do I want this to escalate into personal attacks (which it kinda almost did).  Elias and I like each other and I'm sure neither of us intended any ill will.  I know I didn't and I'm quite positive Elias didn't either.

What we have to look at here are that in order to cull out any theories in order to find the one that explains what happened, there are 2 major things that have to be answered:  Was it possible?  Was it PROBABLE?

Considering that almost anything is possible, the big factor that removes the majority of theories is probability.  Take the argument that .50 cal rifles should be banned that is so often used.  The argument is that 'terrorists' could use the rifles to shoot down a plane.

Is it POSSIBLE to do this?  Yes.  Lobbing a projectile in the air at another object and having that projectile hit it is absolutely possible.

Is it PROBABLE that this could be done?  The answer is no.  Hitting a moving object flying at 300+ mph is extremely difficult to do, especially with a rifle that weighs so damned much.

Now, is it possible that hundreds of government people all worked together to plan this out and execute a controlled demo or mini-nuke or whathave you?  Yes, it is possible.

Is it probable?  Absolutely not.

Remember Occam's Razor.  The simplest solution is more than likely the correct one.  2 planes flew into the towers, burned up the jet fuel, cargo (which included a lot of flammable clothing, etc), and office equipment and papers.  The planes impact with the buildings structural members weakened them so that the resulting fire could further weaken them to the point of failure.

Is the government criminal?  Abso-frickin-lutely.  No argument from me there.  

Was 9/11 the government's fault?  Absolutely.  Again, no argument from me.

Did they do it?  Absolutely not.  To say that they did gives them much more credit than they'd ever deserve.  
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Bill St. Clair

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #43 on: June 15, 2005, 12:04:16 pm »

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Apart from sheer raw power, I can't for the life of me fathom why they do what they do.  And I must be seriously lacking in testosterone or something, because I just don't get off on the whole "unlimited power" kick.... :(  :rolleyes:
I'm with you. I don't understand why some people want power over others. To me, power over another person implies a huge responsibility, and I already have enough responsibility just keeping myself and my family fed, clothed, sheltered, and loved.
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Thunder

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WTC Collapse was Controlled Demolition
« Reply #44 on: June 15, 2005, 12:21:50 pm »

That's because you're a rational human being that just wants to live your life.  You don't have any ego problems or anything like that to cause you to want to have power over someone else.

If for some odd reason I was put into a situation where I was king or something, I'd have the most boring reign as I wouldn't do a damned thing.   :lol:   Go ahead, lead your lives.  I'll be over here in the corner reading a book or taking a nap.  Wake me when my term is up.
 
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There are times, sir, when men of good conscience cannot blindly follow orders.  -Capt. Jean-Luc Picard

Wars will cease when people start loving their children more than they love the government.

People use the term 'chaos' only when they can't see far enough to view the big picture.   -Deepak Chopra

There are no illegal guns, only illegal gun laws.
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