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Author Topic: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)  (Read 1120 times)

mouse

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Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« on: July 14, 2012, 07:33:41 AM »

What do you think of the idea of the "voter id card"?

The idea of the compulsory production of a "drivers' licence or a utility bill would be enough to put me off.  I have a paranoia about the DL being used for anything not connected to traffic and driving and I don't believe that you should have to produce any "papers" for something as simple as voting.  Not that I am advocating that we should vote anyway, that would be  participating in this great scam that is "government" and accepting that you are a slave and that you THINK you "have a say" in what psychopaths take your money from you, and of course you really don't, because it IS a scam and you and me are the victims.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/how-mean-spirited-how-callous-can-you-be-opponents-of-texas-voter-id-law-face-skeptical-court/

(The Blaze/AP) – Lawyers for the state of Texas argued Friday that a contentious voter ID law should go forward because it doesn‘t limit minorities’ right to vote and, therefore, does not violate the federal Voting Rights Act.

Justice Department attorneys argued just the opposite, saying the law requiring voters to show valid, government-issued photo identification at the polls is exactly the type of statute that the act, passed in 1965, was designed to prevent.

Both sides gave closing arguments Friday after a weeklong trial about the Texas law, passed last year by the state’s Republican-controlled Legislature. Texas currently only requires voters to show their voter registration cards, which do not have photos, or another acceptable alternative form of ID such as a driver’s license or utility bill.

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MamaLiberty

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2012, 09:05:59 AM »

Aside from the whole vote thing being worthless, why would anyone object to providing ID to do so? Voter fraud is rampant anyway, of course, but without a reliable ID, what would prevent people from going around to "vote" a dozen or more times?

If you don't object to the ID to drive, or buy a gun, or get a bank account, why would voting be any different?

The whole idea of government issued ID is criminal trespass of our lives, of course, but if you accept some legitimacy for "voting," you've already swallowed that koolaid.
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But, in the end, I live and therefore I am. I don't need any other person's permission to live or defend myself. I don't need anyone's vetting of my intentions or sanity, nor approval for the self defense tool I choose or how I carry it.

I don't NEED to explain myself. I don't NEED any reasons at all.

Hutch

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2012, 04:27:26 PM »

Quote
Voter fraud is rampant anyway, of course, but without a reliable ID, what would prevent people from going around to "vote" a dozen or more times?

Ever heard the phrase " Vote early Vote often" ?

Dead people still vote , out of staters get bussed in , illegals vote....I got no problem cleaning up voter fraud.

If I buy dog food with a credit card , the clerk wants proof of ID.

Voter fraud is a totally under investigated/reported problem.

Hutch
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mouse

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2012, 09:49:06 PM »

Aside from the whole vote thing being worthless, why would anyone object to providing ID to do so? Voter fraud is rampant anyway, of course, but without a reliable ID, what would prevent people from going around to "vote" a dozen or more times?

If you don't object to the ID to drive, or buy a gun, or get a bank account, why would voting be any different?

The whole idea of government issued ID is criminal trespass of our lives, of course, but if you accept some legitimacy for "voting," you've already swallowed that koolaid.

Aside from the "we should have nothing to do with the scam that is the political system", voting is considered to be a human right.  It is not compatible with human rights to have to provide ID when you do everything.  As for "voter fraud", that is something that didn't used to be a problem so why is it suddenly a problem now?  I don't believe that people generally do "vote a dozen or more times" (if they do, this is very rare) and if someone wants to spend the day going to different polling stations voting using different names, then sobeit.  Maybe the people who names they are would have voted for that person anyway.

The thing is that I DO object to the ID "to drive, or to buy a gun, or get a bank account".  Driving is nothing special, it is just exercising our freedom of movement, in the modern sense.  Those who claim that the "freedom of movement" is the freedom to walk are being unrealistic.  Way back in the year dot when I first started driving I didn't have to "produce ID" (ANY ID, "birth certificate" included) and I don't see what has changed today to justify all the intrusiveness in "getting ya licence".  I certainly never had to produce any ID to get a bank account, up until - that is - about 2004, then things changed with the world going "ID crazy", I have not opened a new bank account since then and not likely to because of this.  I was talking about this with the lawyer I saw when we bought this house and he said "well I will have to ask you for ID to complete this transaction", but he never did, and I did warn him that he wouldn't get any ID from me as I didn't have any anyway.  This just showed me that the lawyer didn't really need ID out of either of us, no business really does.

It all comes back to "papers please" and this is not acceptable in any sense of the word.  It is indoctrinating the young to "get used to having to give in the government demands".  I really cringe when I hear someone say "ooh, giggle, giggle, I got asked for ID and I am over 30, oh I must look so young, what a compliment".  I hear that all the time in the supermarket.  People should be aware that "asking for ID" (under any circumstances) is NOT a COMPLIMENT, it is an INSULT!!  It is saying "now you stupid little slave just produce the documentation demanded of you and we may let you go about your business".
« Last Edit: July 14, 2012, 10:03:10 PM by mouse »
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Hutch

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2012, 12:34:10 AM »

I understand and agree with the "Papers Please" argument .

What I don't understand is TPTB's reluctance to insure clean elections.

They have no problem funding a TSA..."Papers Please"... that,to my knowledge, has never arrested an actual terrorist.

Yet,they have no interest in a clean election.

Hutch
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MamaLiberty

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2012, 05:14:05 AM »

This whole "vote is a right" thing has serious problems.

You have a right to your life, liberty and property. These are all things that nobody has any right to interfere with for any human being. No "majority" of the voters can rightfully deprive you of those true rights.

What could you "vote" on that would not infringe on the rights of others? If you think of anything, ask yourself if any vote is ever taken on those things. Why not?

"Voting" is the act whereby some people join with other people to agree to things that DO interfere with the life, liberty and property of others. And even that is seldom the actual purpose because those in control use this seeming consensus of the "majority" to rob and otherwise control everyone.  Control of others is the whole purpose. What other purpose could there be if the "majority" rules.

Life, liberty and property are called "negative" rights because they do not require the violation of anyone else's rights to be honored.
A "right" to vote is not much different than the bogus "right" to free health care, or anything else that can only be done by violating someone else's right to their own life and property. These are called positive "rights," that require others to pay for them or otherwise lose their own rights to their liberty and property. They are not rights at all, of course.

Any "vote" that is not unanimous winds up violating the rights of some people automatically.  And trust me, the powers that be want to keep this vote thing as loosey goosey as possible so there is no real accountability to any of it. It's all a bogus "patriotic" exercise in futility.
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But, in the end, I live and therefore I am. I don't need any other person's permission to live or defend myself. I don't need anyone's vetting of my intentions or sanity, nor approval for the self defense tool I choose or how I carry it.

I don't NEED to explain myself. I don't NEED any reasons at all.

AlEinstein

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2012, 09:07:04 AM »

Elections do not matter anymore since the zionist Rothschild mafia have installed their electronic voting machines throughout the nation.  Elections are now all rigged to whatever outcome the criminals desire.  It is time to awaken to the stench of total corruption and tyranny.

Check out this video proving the electronic voting system is corrupt.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYIezJyhGWY

We need to test people and require basic knowledge of current events and of our system in order to qualify to vote.  Also one must be able to pass the test given to foreigners to become citizens.  One should possess some knowledge of what is happening in the world.  We have millions voting who don't know who their congressman or senators are, yet their voting records on issues.  Some people are so ignorant they cannot even locate our nation on a world map.  These morons voting is the reason we have nothing but criminals in congress.
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PJ

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2012, 02:52:45 PM »

Elections do not matter anymore since the zionist Rothschild mafia have installed their electronic voting machines throughout the nation.  Elections are now all rigged to whatever outcome the criminals desire.  It is time to awaken to the stench of total corruption and tyranny.

Check out this video proving the electronic voting system is corrupt.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYIezJyhGWY

We need to test people and require basic knowledge of current events and of our system in order to qualify to vote.  Also one must be able to pass the test given to foreigners to become citizens.  One should possess some knowledge of what is happening in the world.  We have millions voting who don't know who their congressman or senators are, yet their voting records on issues.  Some people are so ignorant they cannot even locate our nation on a world map.  These morons voting is the reason we have nothing but criminals in congress.
You didn't read Mama Liberty's post, did you?  You are asking for more laws (testing before voting) while she was pointing out that the act of voting itself is a violation of your right to your own life, liberty, and property, because it sets laws in place which limit these natural rights and replaces them with a bunch of fake "rights".
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Hutch

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2012, 11:36:52 PM »

Quote
What could you "vote" on that would not infringe on the rights of others?

A like minded candidate that would represent the voters that put him in office.

Quote
You didn't read Mama Liberty's post, did you?  You are asking for more laws (testing before voting) while she was pointing out that the act of voting itself is a violation of your right to your own life, liberty, and property, because it sets laws in place which limit these natural rights and replaces them with a bunch of fake "rights".

I view the vote as a means to maintain your natural rights .

W/O clean elections it ain't gonna happen.

Hutch
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khyeron

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2012, 12:49:17 AM »

Because a "clean" election between Al Gore and George Bush or George vs Married to Ketchup, or perhaps Bombo the God King vs McLame, yep, those are seriously good elections to have fully honestly.  That'll just fsckin' change the damn world, won't it? 

Hutch, it won't make a third of an iota of difference until all these motherf***ers are strung up by their balls and whipped to death in the public square, by an "honestly elected" body of whippers.  (Use your imaginations for the females in the bunch.)

I, for one, have come to the simple realization that magical thinking rules America and most of the world.  99% or more expect free shit, expect to keep getting it or to get it at some later date, and are only upset because the other magical thinking party or emotional feeling or pride feeling party is in charge.  Does it make a difference?  Not a goddamn bit!  Does it stop them?  Not a goddamn bit!

Get used to it Hutch, and all who are pro elections.

At the local level you "might" accomplish something, but I'll tell you from experience.  More than likely, you won't get shit done even there.  The wishful thinking and authority worship mindsets are so entrenched they cannot be touched anymore, and to conflict with those mindsets is to invite disaster.

I for one, am not a fan, nor will I play that game, except maybe a sheriff's election if the current one in my area proves to be less than just or very anti freedom.  If not, I won't even bother with that.  But again, to those who wish for someone to save them at the national level, good luck voting for either head of the Ettin.  You're still going to get clubbed by the Ettin's club (pigs, enforcement divisions, etc) regardless of which head you please this set of 4 years.
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"Time to beat those plowshares back into swords."  Robert Anson Heinlein

bennie

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2012, 04:05:53 AM »

mouse: you said,  "As for "voter fraud", that is something that didn't used to be a problem so why is it suddenly a problem now?  I don't believe that people generally do "vote a dozen or more times" (if they do, this is very rare) and if someone wants to spend the day going to different polling stations voting using different names, then sobeit.  Maybe the people who names they are would have voted for that person anyway."

Voter fraud has been going on throught written history. In some places it is known to have been the norm http://bloggingforliberty.info/blogging-for-liberty-voter-fraud-lbj-the-duke-of-duval-and-the-big-o/ ..............
-----------------
snip...Lyndon  B. Johnson  (LBJ) earned the nickname “Landslide Lyndon”  or “Ballot box Johnson” in 1948  when he became a U.S. Senator from Texas on the strength of 87 questionable votes.
The setting for the saga of LBJ was South Texas.  The key player was George Parr, “The Duke of Duval,” the boss of the South Texas political machine, and the man called patrón by the Chicano people.
Through a powerful network of alliances, George Parr controlled politics in 15 South Texas counties and wielded influence at the state capital and in Washington.  He also exercised considerable power over economic development in his realm, controlling banks and exacting high tax levies.
 Six days after the polls had closed, the winner for Texas Senator was still not decided, but  miraculously, in the district of Alice, Texas, 202 additional votes suddenly appeared in the Precinct 13 voting box. All but 2 of these were cast for Lyndon Johnson. To make matters worse, these 202 names appeared to be added to the list, were in alphabetical order, were in the same handwriting and written with the same ink.
Fast forward 12 years. During the Presidential election of  1960,  Kennedy benefited from voter fraud, especially in Texas and Illinois, as well as in nine other states.  These two states are particularly important because if Nixon had carried both, he would have won the election. By-the-way, Kennedy was both the last Northern Democrat and sitting United States senator to win the presidency until Obama. Make no mistake about it, Illinois or not, Johnson, with help from Parr, delivered Texas to Kennedy. ...snip
------------
It is said that most of the votes, in 1948, came from the local graveyards. I lived in South Texas in the late 60's and most of the 70's. George Parr was the real deal and very well known even after his death. This is just one example of voter fraud from those days and in just one small area of the US. This stuff goes on in countless places across the country. It happens in many types of variations. Nowadays it happens through the voting machines themselves. It happens with the blessings of those same politicians who are now pushing for voter ID laws. It is a purposeful rigged game designed to make the people feel good about losing.





 

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MamaLiberty

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #11 on: July 16, 2012, 07:03:02 AM »

All true, but the "vote" promoters here need to answer the question:

What do you "vote" on that does not infringe on the rights of at least some of your neighbors? 

Even voting for a "good" sheriff imposes that decision on those who would rather have the "bad" one, doesn't it? Maybe they are both bad... Who decides what is "good" or "bad?" The "majority?" What if the majority of those voting want the "bad" one? What if some of the people don't want ANYONE? They don't count?

Too many people seem to think that this candidate of "like mind" would actually be better for everyone. But each person has a different mind, needs, priorities and goals.  It is impossible for one person to "represent" non-consenting others in any way.

Do you, personally, actually TRUST this "will of the majority" to produce freedom and prosperity for YOU - when the only tool they have is theft and coercion? How is that supposed to work?

Giving people the opportunity to "vote" merely gives them an outlet for their frustration, and the illusion that they have some say in what happens afterwards. 
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But, in the end, I live and therefore I am. I don't need any other person's permission to live or defend myself. I don't need anyone's vetting of my intentions or sanity, nor approval for the self defense tool I choose or how I carry it.

I don't NEED to explain myself. I don't NEED any reasons at all.

mouse

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #12 on: July 16, 2012, 07:07:41 AM »

This whole "vote is a right" thing has serious problems.

You have a right to your life, liberty and property. These are all things that nobody has any right to interfere with for any human being. No "majority" of the voters can rightfully deprive you of those true rights.

What could you "vote" on that would not infringe on the rights of others? If you think of anything, ask yourself if any vote is ever taken on those things. Why not?

"Voting" is the act whereby some people join with other people to agree to things that DO interfere with the life, liberty and property of others. And even that is seldom the actual purpose because those in control use this seeming consensus of the "majority" to rob and otherwise control everyone.  Control of others is the whole purpose. What other purpose could there be if the "majority" rules.

Life, liberty and property are called "negative" rights because they do not require the violation of anyone else's rights to be honored.
A "right" to vote is not much different than the bogus "right" to free health care, or anything else that can only be done by violating someone else's right to their own life and property. These are called positive "rights," that require others to pay for them or otherwise lose their own rights to their liberty and property. They are not rights at all, of course.

Any "vote" that is not unanimous winds up violating the rights of some people automatically.  And trust me, the powers that be want to keep this vote thing as loosey goosey as possible so there is no real accountability to any of it. It's all a bogus "patriotic" exercise in futility.

As usual ML you are quite "spot on".
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mouse

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When the topic came up about the dramatic increase in the prison population in US, for "drug offences", over the last 30 years, I speculated that this was part of the reason.  It is probably not, but 6 million is a staggering figure - one and a half time the population of our entire country, I cannot even imagine that many people.

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/07/black-vote-felon-disenfranchisement-laws-florida

In an updated study released Thursday, the Sentencing Project reports that close to 6 million Americans are now unable to vote thanks to felon disenfranchisement laws. "Approximately 2.5 percent of the total US voting age population—1 of every 40 adults—is disenfranchised due to a current or previous felony conviction," notes the report, authored by Christopher Uggen and Sarah Shannon of the University of Minnesota and Jeff Manza of New York University.

The numbers have risen dramatically over the decades, due both to the rise of mass incarceration in the United States and to the spread of restrictive state voting laws. As we reported last week, nearly all states bar imprisoned felons from voting, 29 states bar them even after they have served their time, and a handful—including several battleground states—effectively bar them for life. The number of affected Americans has ballooned from 1.2 million people in 1976 to 3.3 million in 1996. As of 2010, the figure stands at 5.9 million.

snip
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mouse

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Re: Voter ID (in Texas, so far)
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2012, 07:14:54 AM »

Then there is this:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/07/voter-id-laws-charts-maps

UFO Sightings Are More Common Than Voter Fraud
The GOP says election fraud is rampant. A close look at the numbers shows there's no evidence of that.

snip (go to link there is a lot of info.)
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